Originally Posted By: The Resurrection
 Originally Posted By: kc120us
 Originally Posted By: Zipper68
 Originally Posted By: kc120us
 Originally Posted By: Zipper68
 Originally Posted By: buttock
I don't think that anyone can reliably claim to detect or rule out trimming when done well. I think in some cases, there are probably tell-tale signs, but I'm sure there are probably just as many cases with no signs. Therefore a CGC "OK" doesn't mean it's not trimmed. Nor would an OK from anyone else.


I agree with this. Just like a "not guilty" verdict doesn't mean someone is innocent, a CGC OK means they can't tell with certainty it is trimmed.

This is not a knock on CGC... when done on the cover only and a very small amount is taken off, it may very well be impossible to know with certainty in some cases. Especially if the paper is fresh and well preserved... it may not exhibit some of the same "cracking" or snags that can happen when typically aged paper is cut.


Does that invalidate the certification in your opinion?


In this case, I think "certification" means that you've exercised due diligence in pursuing the truth.

Could I sell the book to another owner knowing I did my best to determine I wasn't passing off tainted goods? Yes.

Would I bet my life the book isn't trimmed? No.

Exactly, Steve and that is all you could do. Just as if you sent the book to Susan or Matt, you would have done your best to have the book examined for resto. Might they miss something, sure. Does it invalidate their examination? No.


Casey,

In response to this. CGC has how many submissions per day, and how many people who are "restoration experts". The volume of which books are submitted is what they are going to see the biggest problems with. I would imagine that when you send them a book they will give it the once over, but if nothing throws up a flag I doubt HIGHLY that they put much effort into this.

In susan or matts case, they see a considerably smaller amount of books, therefore allowing more time for a more thorough check. So if I REALLY wanted to be sure about my books condition it would go to them.

If I want a sweet holder, grade, and maximum cash potential on the market. I go with CGC. Or if I really was that concerned it would go to Matt or Susan before CGC. Costing a little more cash, but I know the book will have been thoroughly examined prior to slabbing.


Actually Pat I think CGC's rate of resto detection is probably on par with Matt or Susans. Once you get good at spotting it, it litterally jumps out at you and I imagine their screening, grading process includes a checklist of everything that Matt or Susan would look for. But I will agree it is the sheer volume of books that might allow things like micro trimming to slip through because of how hard it is to detect due to how closely it mimics production methods and it might be done to books that otherwise show no visible signs of other resto.

Do you have examples of books that CGC missed resto on that Susan or Matt detected?
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