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Is AMS #1 extremely undervalued?
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25 posts in this topic

I am not a big thread starter. I would really like to hear some opinions on this topic. I look back on Superman and Batman and see a very similar situation as Spider-man. All three first appearances happened in another title (as I am sure you know!) All 3 Hero's went on as #1's, anchoring very long runs. All three are at the top as far as most popular super hero's ever. The biggest difference is the tiny golden age availability compared to Spider-man books that are abundant. Demand for all 3 seems unstoppable (even with the more available Spider-Man books)

 

Both Superman's and Batman's #1's are very serious high value books and very rare. Will spider-man #1 ever be a huge book and looked at as undervalued during this time period? What do you think? Are these 3 even comparable?

Edited by paul747
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I don't think a Silver Age book that has sold for over a quarter million dollars (2nd highest graded!) could ever be considered extremely undervalued.

 

Undervalued as a comparison to the other 2 situations !

 

AMS #1 highest or second highest graded seems to be 20 percent of the cost of a similar graded Amazing fantasy #15 But the other two #1's (Batman & Superman) seem to be in the 30 percent or higher range as compared to there first appearance counter parts. Its hard to have exact data on the golden age copies they are much rarer. What would an 8.0 Tec #27 sell for in this market? What would an 8.0 Superman #1 sell for?

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Scarcity comes into play in comparing a Tec #27, Superman #1, Batman #1 to an ASM #1. You're talking a 25 year difference between the comparative releases. There are 3122 ASM #1s on the census and only 64 Tec #27's. Because of this, the gap between the two will never close. I think ASM #1's slow growth is about to end because the AF15 is becoming unreachable for many collectors and the demand is increasing as we speak. The past few months there has been a tremendous growth in price across all grades which is a good sign. So is it undervalued? I don't think so since value is determined by demand. But I think we'll start to see prices rise very quickly over the next year. I would prefer it doesn't since an ASM #1 is my top priority for 2017. I would really like a higher grade copy but I feel by the time I'm ready to pull the trigger (Waiting until Wizard Con in Chicago in August) I may get a grade less than I expected for the amount I planned on spending...

Edited by comicquant
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It's not a first appearance and the cover is a turn off for many. It's a very cool book but it's a second banana to af15. When people want to splurge on a spidey book, af15 is what they want

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It's not a first appearance and the cover is a turn off for many. It's a very cool book but it's a second banana to af15. When people want to splurge on a spidey book, af15 is what they want

 

Kirby's cover on AF 15 is a turn off for me - much prefer the unused Ditko version...

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It's not a first appearance and the cover is a turn off for many. It's a very cool book but it's a second banana to af15. When people want to splurge on a spidey book, af15 is what they want
I love both covers ! #1's cover is iconic. I did not realize "alot of people dont like AMS #1's cover"

 

I need a Valiant man formula or something.

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I don't think a Silver Age book that has sold for over a quarter million dollars (2nd highest graded!) could ever be considered extremely undervalued.

 

Undervalued as a comparison to the other 2 situations !

 

AMS #1 highest or second highest graded seems to be 20 percent of the cost of a similar graded Amazing fantasy #15 But the other two #1's (Batman & Superman) seem to be in the 30 percent or higher range as compared to there first appearance counter parts. Its hard to have exact data on the golden age copies they are much rarer. What would an 8.0 Tec #27 sell for in this market? What would an 8.0 Superman #1 sell for?

 

This is tough comparison to make. Here's what I think of the values ( detailed discussion is available here)

 

Best Action #1 (Church/Dentist's copy): $7,500,000

Best known Supeman #1 (Dentist's copy): $3,000,000

 

Best Detective #27 (Allentown/Dentist's copy): $6,500,000

Best Batman #1 (Church/Dentist's copy): $1,500,000

 

Best AF #15 (3 9.6s) $1,250,000

Best ASM #1 (1 9.8) $500,000 (but could go higher because it's single highest graded)

 

 

Superman #1 is SO DIFFICULT in high grade and Batman #1 is so (Relatively) easy, the ratios are meaningless.

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As mentioned a few posts up, comparing high demand GA books to high demand SA books is not always the best. No doubt scads more ASM 1 exist than Bats or Supes 1. Perhaps looking at JLA 1 would be more appropriate in comparing growth percentages.

 

In any event, the market demand determines the value. I think it is no go wrong investment book that will continue to grow in value and am happy I picked up both a AF 15 and ASM 1 some time ago. As to what the growth rate may be, I have no idea but feel pretty safe if I ever do sell mine, I will see a decent ROI.

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It's not a first appearance and the cover is a turn off for many. It's a very cool book but it's a second banana to af15. When people want to splurge on a spidey book, af15 is what they want
I love both covers ! #1's cover is iconic. I did not realize "alot of people dont like AMS #1's cover"

 

I need a Valiant man formula or something.

The simplest way to look at it would be to look at average copies.

The highest grades are a different animal with their own market.

Just talking about ASM #1 possibly being undervalued would be across all grades.

 

An average (universal) copy of each of the big 3 would be:

Action #1, CGC 4.17, about $700,000

Detective #27, CGC 4.85, about $600,000

Amazing Fantasy #15, CGC 3.63, about $15,000

 

Now, look at the average (universal) copy of the regular series #1s...

Superman #1, CGC 2.61, about $150,000

Batman #1, CGC 3.51, about $125,000

ASM #1, CGC 3.98, about $5,000

 

We're seeing 21% for the average Superman #1 vs. Action #1.

We're seeing 21% for the average Batman #1 vs. Detective #27.

We're seeing 33% for the average ASM #1 vs. AF #15.

 

Now, we could argue that ASM #1 deserves to be 33% because the other two books aren't second appearances, but the 2nd appearances of Superman and Batman aren't 33% of the first appearances either. Looking at the Big 3, an argument could be made that ASM #1 is not undervalued vs. AF #15. Should ASM #1 fall closer to 21%, or should AF #15 increase if ASM #1 stays steady? Different debate.

 

Between Superman #1, Batman #1, and ASM #1, it's probably the Superman #1 that is underpriced.

 

There are only 50 universal copies for Superman #1 compared to 97 for Batman #1, but you can get an "average" copy of Superman #1 (about CGC 2.6) for about the same price as an "average" copy of Batman #1 (about CGC 3.5).

 

Assuming the Batman #1 isn't going down, it's the Superman #1 that probably needs to increase on average since there are half as many of them.

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It's not a first appearance and the cover is a turn off for many. It's a very cool book but it's a second banana to af15. When people want to splurge on a spidey book, af15 is what they want
I love both covers ! #1's cover is iconic. I did not realize "alot of people dont like AMS #1's cover"

 

I need a Valiant man formula or something.

The simplest way to look at it would be to look at average copies.

The highest grades are a different animal with their own market.

Just talking about ASM #1 possibly being undervalued would be across all grades.

 

An average (universal) copy of each of the big 3 would be:

Action #1, CGC 4.17, about $700,000

Detective #27, CGC 4.85, about $600,000

Amazing Fantasy #15, CGC 3.63, about $15,000

 

Now, look at the average (universal) copy of the regular series #1s...

Superman #1, CGC 2.61, about $150,000

Batman #1, CGC 3.51, about $125,000

ASM #1, CGC 3.98, about $5,000

 

We're seeing 21% for the average Superman #1 vs. Action #1.

We're seeing 21% for the average Batman #1 vs. Detective #27.

We're seeing 33% for the average ASM #1 vs. AF #15.

 

Now, we could argue that ASM #1 deserves to be 33% because the other two books aren't second appearances, but the 2nd appearances of Superman and Batman aren't 33% of the first appearances either. Looking at the Big 3, an argument could be made that ASM #1 is not undervalued vs. AF #15. Should ASM #1 fall closer to 21%, or should AF #15 increase if ASM #1 stays steady? Different debate.

 

Between Superman #1, Batman #1, and ASM #1, it's probably the Superman #1 that is underpriced.

 

There are only 50 universal copies for Superman #1 compared to 97 for Batman #1, but you can get an "average" copy of Superman #1 (about CGC 2.6) for about the same price as an "average" copy of Batman #1 (about CGC 3.5).

 

Assuming the Batman #1 isn't going down, it's the Superman #1 that probably needs to increase on average since there are half as many of them.

+100 thanks !
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I can't see them being comparable in scarcity or perceived value. Demand is clearly there but there are too many out there in comparison. Don't get me wrong, Spidey books are great but I believe AF 15 will have to settle for top lofty status atop the Silver Age. I think the prices are way too high right now but maybe that's because I don't have one and want one. (shrug)

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It's not a first appearance and the cover is a turn off for many. It's a very cool book but it's a second banana to af15. When people want to splurge on a spidey book, af15 is what they want
I love both covers ! #1's cover is iconic. I did not realize "alot of people dont like AMS #1's cover"

 

I need a Valiant man formula or something.

The simplest way to look at it would be to look at average copies.

The highest grades are a different animal with their own market.

Just talking about ASM #1 possibly being undervalued would be across all grades.

 

An average (universal) copy of each of the big 3 would be:

Action #1, CGC 4.17, about $700,000

Detective #27, CGC 4.85, about $600,000

Amazing Fantasy #15, CGC 3.63, about $15,000

 

Now, look at the average (universal) copy of the regular series #1s...

Superman #1, CGC 2.61, about $150,000

Batman #1, CGC 3.51, about $125,000

ASM #1, CGC 3.98, about $5,000

 

We're seeing 21% for the average Superman #1 vs. Action #1.

We're seeing 21% for the average Batman #1 vs. Detective #27.

We're seeing 33% for the average ASM #1 vs. AF #15.

 

Now, we could argue that ASM #1 deserves to be 33% because the other two books aren't second appearances, but the 2nd appearances of Superman and Batman aren't 33% of the first appearances either. Looking at the Big 3, an argument could be made that ASM #1 is not undervalued vs. AF #15. Should ASM #1 fall closer to 21%, or should AF #15 increase if ASM #1 stays steady? Different debate.

 

Between Superman #1, Batman #1, and ASM #1, it's probably the Superman #1 that is underpriced.

 

There are only 50 universal copies for Superman #1 compared to 97 for Batman #1, but you can get an "average" copy of Superman #1 (about CGC 2.6) for about the same price as an "average" copy of Batman #1 (about CGC 3.5).

 

Assuming the Batman #1 isn't going down, it's the Superman #1 that probably needs to increase on average since there are half as many of them.

 

Great analysis.

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It's not a first appearance and the cover is a turn off for many. It's a very cool book but it's a second banana to af15. When people want to splurge on a spidey book, af15 is what they want

 

Kirby's cover on AF 15 is a turn off for me - much prefer the unused Ditko version...

 

 

I had no idea! Very cool...

 

https://comicstalkblog.com/archives/5318

 

BUT, I actually like Kirby's cover better.

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It's not a first appearance and the cover is a turn off for many. It's a very cool book but it's a second banana to af15. When people want to splurge on a spidey book, af15 is what they want

 

Kirby's cover on AF 15 is a turn off for me - much prefer the unused Ditko version...

 

 

I had no idea! Very cool...

 

https://comicstalkblog.com/archives/5318

 

BUT, I actually like Kirby's cover better.

I did not know that either. cool
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I'm a big Ditko fan but that cover of his is horrible! Kirby's is iconic and deservedly so! 2c

 

I agree with you based on the BW line art. Huge type everywhere etc. but if it were colored well, in deep muted colors like AF15 is that Spidey was more prominent, I bet it would look just fine as a cover.

Edited by aman619
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