Newbie questions about resto

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Hello all! I am new to comic collecting and investing. I have an opportunity to pick up a nice restored book, but have some questions before I purchase.

The book appears to be between an 8.0-9.0. There is color touch, trim, and a dab of glue on the spine.

1) does the glue on the spine hit the grade at all?

2) does the trim make it worth less? Some comic friends of mine dont like trim and they advised me to turn away. Does it really matter of its trimmed?

3) how much does a restored book go for? Half an unrestored? 20%? Does it depend on the book or level of resto?

Thank you for your time

I wouldn't touch a trimmed book. If it presented well and was a major key, the resto wouldn't bother me. If it was trimmed, I wouldn't touch it though.

I think the market agrees too.

Trimming is a big turn off for many collectors, as much if not more so than pieces added. It can hurt the value of an otherwise high grade book more than other types of resto, like minor color touch or glue. A trimmed page overhang would probably not be as big a deal as a trimmed cover.

Value is a factor of apparent grade, type and degree of restoration, as well as desirability and scarcity of the book. Era is a factor as well. GA books can find buyers more readily with minor restoration than do later eras. Restored 8.0-9.0 books, especially if Silver Age or later are going to take a much bigger hit than a 2.0 Golden Age.

One would need more of description to tell if the resto would classify as minor or moderate, amateur or professional, but generally one would expect to pay at most 40% of unrestored value for an apparent 8.0 with all but the most minor of restoration, and certainly not any more if it's been trimmed in addition to other work. An apparent 9.0 probably wouldn't get a much higher price, as the main reason for paying the multiples that higher grades garner, is that such books are in their natural state. I've heard of 9.0s with minor/mod. resto sell for as little as 10% of what an unrestored 9.0 might sell for.

Trimming is not a one size fits all scenario....... you would definitely need to provide more details as to the effect on the book...... trimming is the one resto procedure that is often determined by a grader's "gut feeling"..... some are better at spotting it than others.... me, if it's a very hard to find book that I've wanted for years and the trimming is what is referred to as "micro" for a nice discount, wrap it up, I'll take it. That's just me, though..... I'm one of those weird guys who collects for himself, not "the market". GOD BLESS...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

...if you want good advice, we at least need details on specific book, price, work done, etc.............

If the book is valuable enough, you could always have the trimmed paper replaced.

Hello all! I am new to comic collecting and investing. I have an opportunity to pick up a nice restored book, but have some questions before I purchase.

 

The book appears to be between an 8.0-9.0. There is color touch, trim, and a dab of glue on the spine.

 

1) does the glue on the spine hit the grade at all?

 

2) does the trim make it worth less? Some comic friends of mine dont like trim and they advised me to turn away. Does it really matter of its trimmed?

 

3) how much does a restored book go for? Half an unrestored? 20%? Does it depend on the book or level of resto?

 

Thank you for your time

A trimmed book is essentially toxic sludge and will be incredibly difficult to resell if you're looking for an investment book. If I were ever to intentionally buy a restored book it would be one I could reverse. Such as a couple of dots of color touch etc. I would wager most trimmed books were born out of deception which is probably why they are so shunned.

I would wager most trimmed books were born out of deception which is probably why they are so shunned.

one could argue other forms of resto might be born out of deception.

even CT, which doesn't seem to bother many as much

I would wager most trimmed books were born out of deception which is probably why they are so shunned.

 

one could argue other forms of resto might be born out of deception.

 

even CT, which doesn't seem to bother many as much

Agreed and probably more accurately stated as "...most restored books...".

I would wager most trimmed books were born out of deception which is probably why they are so shunned.

 

one could argue other forms of resto might be born out of deception.

 

even CT, which doesn't seem to bother many as much

I'm not so sure. Glue largely serves the same purpose as tape, but is less obtrusive, and is generally used to reattach covers or seal tears so they don't get worse. Color touch, fills and pieces added have their origins in amateur restoration that clearly deceived no one, and most likely was the result of collectors bothered by unsightly color breaking creases or pieces missing from the covers. Only later did techniques reach the point where they became difficult to spot, but even in the 1970s the value differences between restored and unrestored were not that great, though enough to warrant disclosure. Once there was a monetary difference in values between unrestored and professionally, hard to detect, restored books, there were going to be those looking for an edge, and deception follows.

With the exception of pages trimmed due to overhangs and bound volumes, I'm guessing trimming wasn't that common until values got to such that bumping a single grade or two was worth the effort of deception to some, largely the same group that had no problem with serious overgrading, selling incomplete books as complete, and other forms of chicanery.

Thank you all for the reaponses! This is the book in question:

Look at this on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/201775596396

I know a lot of you say that you should avoid resto or trim at all cost; but all books have a price. What do you think this book is worth, and what would you pay for it if you were me?

Thank you all for the reaponses! This is the book in question:

 

Look at this on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/201775596396

 

I know a lot of you say that you should avoid resto or trim at all cost; but all books have a price. What do you think this book is worth, and what would you pay for it if you were me?

There are other boardies that know much more about this seller, but i can tell you I don't think you'll hear a single positive comment. This seller has a horrible reputation and most people won't buy books from him. Below is a link to a recent thread that touches on the subject.

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9353442&fpart=1

I've never purchased a book from this seller so all I can say is "buyer beware".

There are currently about 64 other copies of that book available on ebay alone, in all grades and price ranges. Why not buy one that hasn't been messed with? Furthermore, why give your money to a well documented, known crook rather than a reputable seller? All that does is support bad behavior.

I can't speak to personal experience with the seller, but that copy has been chopped on the top and bottom, as well as the cover trimmed on the side, possibly to hide chipping. While the only CT obvious in the scan is the grey around the bottom staple, I would not be surprised to find the black areas doctored when looking at it in hand. There is a cut or tear along the back at the lower staple, and it's unclear what is meant by "glue on spine", it could be a major split has now been glued to the spine of the book. Just the degree of trimming alone would put me off that book for all but a real bargain price.

This book looks deceptively "high grade" in the scan, but in hand, obvious flaws plus the degree of trimming might leave it with an apparent grade far less than hoped for.

For that price, I'd look for a slabbed unrestored 4.0 copy, or a raw 5.0 from a trusted dealer, or even a higher grade copy with minimal resto or conservation ( like staples cleaned, a small tear seal, or very minor CT, but no trimming)

Thank you all for he replies. I will not buy this item. So just so I understand, he buys books, trims them excessively, then resells them as high grade?

I do understand how that is annoying, but what is the issue as long as he clearly states it is restored? Is it because he is destroying a perfectly good book?

'If' this seller is the one doing the trimming on a larger scale, a business model, I think he should be avoided. Destroying the integrity of the books for profit is not good for the hobby. Yes, he is disclosing, and technically he is not doing anything illegal but I would never support him as a customer.

I would wager most trimmed books were born out of deception which is probably why they are so shunned.

 

one could argue other forms of resto might be born out of deception.

 

even CT, which doesn't seem to bother many as much

 

I'm not so sure. Glue largely serves the same purpose as tape, but is less obtrusive, and is generally used to reattach covers or seal tears so they don't get worse. Color touch, fills and pieces added have their origins in amateur restoration that clearly deceived no one, and most likely was the result of collectors bothered by unsightly color breaking creases or pieces missing from the covers. Only later did techniques reach the point where they became difficult to spot, but even in the 1970s the value differences between restored and unrestored were not that great, though enough to warrant disclosure. Once there was a monetary difference in values between unrestored and professionally, hard to detect, restored books, there were going to be those looking for an edge, and deception follows.

 

With the exception of pages trimmed due to overhangs and bound volumes, I'm guessing trimming wasn't that common until values got to such that bumping a single grade or two was worth the effort of deception to some, largely the same group that had no problem with serious overgrading, selling incomplete books as complete, and other forms of chicanery.

 

For sure... It's likely we've all seen (or come across) sellers who list books with colour touch at higher grades than they really are...trying to squeeze a few extra dollars. I know I have. A local guy does this all the time. He's become notorious for it actually. most of his early SA books have CT.

Still is deception

'If' this seller is the one doing the trimming on a larger scale, a business model, I think he should be avoided. Destroying the integrity of the books for profit is not good for the hobby. Yes, he is disclosing, and technically he is not doing anything illegal but I would never support him as a customer.

Agreed. It's not at all good for the hobby

Color touch can be removed and so can the glue, though most likely the grade will drop. You can't remove trimming, so like most people have mentioned, trimmed books are usually avoided.

This is kind of in the same vein and looking for some advice from more seasoned golden age collectors. Is there a percentage that you would typically pay for a book that is conserved? If it is cgc 4.0 and medium level of conservation would that be 50% of a blue label 4.0? Less? More? Any advice and sharing of knowledge would be appreciated. Thanks