Moderns that are heating up on ebay!

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It seems with moderns there are always winners and losers. The guy who sells some ultra hot variant that he bought for $10 for $200, he wins. The guy who bought book at $200 when he could wait it out and get it for $40, he loses. People can spend their money however they want, but it doesn't make it a wise decision.

 

 

What if the $200 variant is now worth $400? Or $500? Or $1000? What if he bought TMNT 1 when it came out because everyone else wanted it?

 

He would have had to have waited a longggg time to see that one pan out.

 

At the height of the B&W craze, TMNT #1 was a $150-$300 book.

 

That was 1986.

 

By 1999, the book was $50-$100...if you could find a buyer.

 

It's only been in the last 10 or so years that you would have seen much of a return on that "top price paid" in 1986.

 

And, something a lot of people don't count on is death. People die. People die waiting to buy that one item that they really wanted, and they never get a chance to. Life is short, and unpredictable. Not everyone has the luxury of sitting on something for 10, 15, 20, 30 years to see some sort of profit if they bought at the height of a particular market.

I've only been on this board a short time and am still learning a lot, but in that time I've seen a handful of boardies with consistently informative and high-quality posts and perspectives, and you have always been one of them. And this post reinforces it.

It seems with moderns there are always winners and losers. The guy who sells some ultra hot variant that he bought for $10 for $200, he wins. The guy who bought book at $200 when he could wait it out and get it for $40, he loses. People can spend their money however they want, but it doesn't make it a wise decision.

 

Or unwise. If having it now -- and evading the anxiety of waiting it out (not knowing whether that'll lead to ownership or not) -- is worth the extra money to them, then it seems like a wise decision. Especially if the money differential is meaningless to them.

Yeah, there's a certain enjoyment value, and pride of ownership that has to be factored in.

I see a subscription cover for blood thirsty sold for almost $30 with shipping.

It seems with moderns there are always winners and losers. The guy who sells some ultra hot variant that he bought for $10 for $200, he wins. The guy who bought book at $200 when he could wait it out and get it for $40, he loses. People can spend their money however they want, but it doesn't make it a wise decision.

 

 

What if the $200 variant is now worth $400? Or $500? Or $1000? What if he bought TMNT 1 when it came out because everyone else wanted it?

 

Don't know what TMNT #1 has to do with anything, but for every 1 variant that actually goes up in price after a year, I could point out 100 that go down. By in large it is not a smart game to play.

 

I don't know what to tell you. I just mean it seems that everyone here is acting like every book is a loser and buying anything when it is hot is a stupid idea. It also seems to paint a rather bleak picture and is portraying the end user as an insufficiently_thoughtful_person that is not capable of understanding what they are doing or buying. Are variants, in broad generalities, not good investments the week of release? Probably. Do books dry up and get hotter once they are all stashed away in personal collections? Sometimes.

Lot of logic here. Currently the market is full of speculators who weren't in the market a few years ago. You only need to look at the growth of Goggle Groups, Facebook and Speculator web sites. This has all exploded in the last couple of years. Good or bad it will take a few years to play out. Its happened before some of us are old enough to have had a prime seat when it happened last time.

1st app vs cameos is a prime example of the changing mentality. I am not sure it will stay around, but at some point somebody is going to get tired of paying thru the nose for a book with just a cover appearance. The trick currently is convincing the next guy. Its pretty easy to see it when the only discussion is a print run, 1st appearance, or variant.

Lot of logic here. Currently the market is full of speculators who weren't in the market a few years ago. You only need to look at the growth of Goggle Groups, Facebook and Speculator web sites. This has all exploded in the last couple of years. Good or bad it will take a few years to play out. Its happened before some of us are old enough to have had a prime seat when it happened last time.

 

1st app vs cameos is a prime example of the changing mentality. I am not sure it will stay around, but at some point somebody is going to get tired of paying thru the nose for a book with just a cover appearance. The trick currently is convincing the next guy. Its pretty easy to see it when the only discussion is a print run, 1st appearance, or variant.

Very true. I am one of those speculators who got back into the mix thanks to these websites.

Lot of logic here. Currently the market is full of speculators who weren't in the market a few years ago. You only need to look at the growth of Goggle Groups, Facebook and Speculator web sites. This has all exploded in the last couple of years. Good or bad it will take a few years to play out. Its happened before some of us are old enough to have had a prime seat when it happened last time.

 

1st app vs cameos is a prime example of the changing mentality. I am not sure it will stay around, but at some point somebody is going to get tired of paying thru the nose for a book with just a cover appearance. The trick currently is convincing the next guy. Its pretty easy to see it when the only discussion is a print run, 1st appearance, or variant.

 

 

Very true. I am one of those speculators who got back into the mix thanks to these websites.

Heyyyyyy, I resemble those remarks. I got back into the hobby in Aug 2013. I thought variants were very cool and bought a lot of them. Now, I still speculate on moderns but I know enough to have Silver, Bronze and a little Copper in my collection and to not buy so many variants.

It's all a learning experience. Unfortunately, the "old guard" are pretty uppity when it comes to speculation.

Regardless of what people think about how others should spend THEIR OWN money, the hobby is just fine. In fact, some of the new collectors/speculators are the ones buying their Gold, Silver, Bronze and Copper so that they can buy that same book in a higher grade (speculation). It's still called speculation. Even "readers" aren't buying books to fold up and put it in their back pocket. Books are read very carefully so as not to cause any, or more, damage, speculating that the book will not decrease in "value". Speculation, Holmes.

Lot of logic here. Currently the market is full of speculators who weren't in the market a few years ago. You only need to look at the growth of Goggle Groups, Facebook and Speculator web sites. This has all exploded in the last couple of years. Good or bad it will take a few years to play out. Its happened before some of us are old enough to have had a prime seat when it happened last time.

 

1st app vs cameos is a prime example of the changing mentality. I am not sure it will stay around, but at some point somebody is going to get tired of paying thru the nose for a book with just a cover appearance. The trick currently is convincing the next guy. Its pretty easy to see it when the only discussion is a print run, 1st appearance, or variant.

 

 

Very true. I am one of those speculators who got back into the mix thanks to these websites.

 

Heyyyyyy, I resemble those remarks. I got back into the hobby in Aug 2013. I thought variants were very cool and bought a lot of them. Now, I still speculate on moderns but I know enough to have Silver, Bronze and a little Copper in my collection and to not buy so many variants.

 

It's all a learning experience. Unfortunately, the "old guard" are pretty uppity when it comes to speculation.

 

Regardless of what people think about how others should spend THEIR OWN money, the hobby is just fine. In fact, some of the new collectors/speculators are the ones buying their Gold, Silver, Bronze and Copper so that they can buy that same book in a higher grade (speculation). It's still called speculation. Even "readers" aren't buying books to fold up and put it in their back pocket. Books are read very carefully so as not to cause any, or more, damage, speculating that the book will not decrease in "value". Speculation, Holmes.

I talked to my LCS owner earlier today, he told me that SDTU #12 had a print run of 7000.

 

I asked if he was sure of that and he said he was.

 

Except there's no where he could've gotten that information. He has no proof.

 

I normally order 2 copies of Scooby Do TU for my store, I ordered 12 of #12. I'm certainly not the only person who upped their order on it.

 

I'm also thinking it's going to be in the 10-12,000 range. At least.

I'll ask him where he got that figure of 7,000 from, , in a couple days, next time I stop by his shop.

He also said that he thought the book was worthless and he was annoyed that he had 5 people walk in, he had never seen before, asking if he had any copies.

He has 0 copies for sale, FTR.

I've known the guy for a couple years, he's a pretty straight forward guy and he does not chase after ,or push, hot books.That said, he has no motive to tell me that he was "sure" that the print run was 7000.

Maybe he knows somebody at DC or Diamond and got some inside intelligence...or maybe not.hell if I know.

In any event, even if the print run was as low as 7000, that is not inordinately rare and the book has *absolutely no* tie in to DC continuity, nor the Suicide Squad movie related scenery.

Some dooshbag sellers are listing it as " the 1st App. Gotham Girls"....which is an outright fabrication.Just saying, it is the sort of gimmicky hot book that speculators hear has a super low print run and morally bankrupt eBay flippers use any means they can dream of to get multiples of cover price for a book that came out 2 weeks ago.

Once CGC gets flooded with subs of this book,I think the price point on slabbed 9.8's will be around $25 to $50.

I talked to my LCS owner earlier today, he told me that SDTU #12 had a print run of 7000.

 

I asked if he was sure of that and he said he was.

 

Except there's no where he could've gotten that information. He has no proof.

 

I normally order 2 copies of Scooby Do TU for my store, I ordered 12 of #12. I'm certainly not the only person who upped their order on it.

 

I'm also thinking it's going to be in the 10-12,000 range. At least.

 

I'll ask him where he got that figure of 7,000 from, , in a couple days, next time I stop by his shop.

 

He also said that he thought the book was worthless and he was annoyed that he had 5 people walk in, he had never seen before, asking if he had any copies.

 

He has 0 copies for sale, FTR.

 

I've known the guy for a couple years, he's a pretty straight forward guy and he does not chase after ,or push, hot books.That said, he has no motive to tell me that he was "sure" that the print run was 7000.

 

Maybe he knows somebody at DC or Diamond and got some inside intelligence...or maybe not.hell if I know.

 

In any event, even if the print run was as low as 7000, that is not inordinately rare and the book has *absolutely no* tie in to DC continuity, nor the Suicide Squad movie related scenery.

 

Some dooshbag sellers are listing it as " the 1st App. Gotham Girls"....which is an outright fabrication.Just saying, it is the sort of gimmicky hot book that speculators hear has a super low print run and morally bankrupt eBay flippers use any means they can dream of to get multiples of cover price for a book that came out 2 weeks ago.

 

Once CGC gets flooded with subs of this book,I think the price point on slabbed 9.8's will be around $25 to $50.

You just described BA 12.

-J.

Lot of logic here. Currently the market is full of speculators who weren't in the market a few years ago. You only need to look at the growth of Goggle Groups, Facebook and Speculator web sites. This has all exploded in the last couple of years. Good or bad it will take a few years to play out. Its happened before some of us are old enough to have had a prime seat when it happened last time.

 

1st app vs cameos is a prime example of the changing mentality. I am not sure it will stay around, but at some point somebody is going to get tired of paying thru the nose for a book with just a cover appearance. The trick currently is convincing the next guy. Its pretty easy to see it when the only discussion is a print run, 1st appearance, or variant.

 

 

Very true. I am one of those speculators who got back into the mix thanks to these websites.

 

Heyyyyyy, I resemble those remarks. I got back into the hobby in Aug 2013. I thought variants were very cool and bought a lot of them. Now, I still speculate on moderns but I know enough to have Silver, Bronze and a little Copper in my collection and to not buy so many variants.

 

It's all a learning experience. Unfortunately, the "old guard" are pretty uppity when it comes to speculation.

 

Regardless of what people think about how others should spend THEIR OWN money, the hobby is just fine. In fact, some of the new collectors/speculators are the ones buying their Gold, Silver, Bronze and Copper so that they can buy that same book in a higher grade (speculation). It's still called speculation. Even "readers" aren't buying books to fold up and put it in their back pocket. Books are read very carefully so as not to cause any, or more, damage, speculating that the book will not decrease in "value". Speculation, Holmes.

Partially true, but that is not the proper, original meaning of the word "speculation", which meant study. As long as the term started to involve calculations about income and mere commercial value its own meaning was overshadowed by considerations of convenience and no longer for the love of knowledge as a means of caring.

Regardless of how each one of us "feels" about it, what remains important in objects we cherish and/or collect is (in the case of comics) what the artistic value of the stories (or even the art) has given and gives us.

If calculations about value help to keep the market healthy, be them welcome, otherwise we are on a slippery slope.

Lot of logic here. Currently the market is full of speculators who weren't in the market a few years ago. You only need to look at the growth of Goggle Groups, Facebook and Speculator web sites. This has all exploded in the last couple of years. Good or bad it will take a few years to play out. Its happened before some of us are old enough to have had a prime seat when it happened last time.

 

1st app vs cameos is a prime example of the changing mentality. I am not sure it will stay around, but at some point somebody is going to get tired of paying thru the nose for a book with just a cover appearance. The trick currently is convincing the next guy. Its pretty easy to see it when the only discussion is a print run, 1st appearance, or variant.

 

 

Very true. I am one of those speculators who got back into the mix thanks to these websites.

 

Heyyyyyy, I resemble those remarks. I got back into the hobby in Aug 2013. I thought variants were very cool and bought a lot of them. Now, I still speculate on moderns but I know enough to have Silver, Bronze and a little Copper in my collection and to not buy so many variants.

 

It's all a learning experience. Unfortunately, the "old guard" are pretty uppity when it comes to speculation.

 

Regardless of what people think about how others should spend THEIR OWN money, the hobby is just fine. In fact, some of the new collectors/speculators are the ones buying their Gold, Silver, Bronze and Copper so that they can buy that same book in a higher grade (speculation). It's still called speculation. Even "readers" aren't buying books to fold up and put it in their back pocket. Books are read very carefully so as not to cause any, or more, damage, speculating that the book will not decrease in "value". Speculation, Holmes.

Again you weren't here for the last go around with large scale speculation from card dealers. So please don't tell me you understand the market when you just above admitted to being a victim when you started.

I got nothing personal against speculation. We all do it some extent. Even your ridiculous paragraph about doesn't really bother me. Where I have issues is just the outright lying and manipulation that comes with large scale speculation. Or when speculator web site pump a book that they themselves have bought dozens of copies. You cant be unbiased when you are vested in the success of the book you are reporting on.

I seriously doubt you know what readers do with their books or even what they read.

Speculators happen. There are good speculators and bad speculators (the ones Fastball mentioned that lie and create websites in order to manipulate the market to their own ends). In the end though, for speculators to survive, collectors must outnumber them by a decent ratio. If the ratio drops or, god forbid, speculators outnumber collectors, then speculators are in for a shock. Right now, I think there are still more collectors than speculators but the ratio has shrunk significantly over the last few years. in an oversimplified nutshell, the 90's crash happened because the speculator dollar vastly outnumbered the collector dollar.

The relationship between speculators and collectors can be mutually beneficial, like a symbiotic relationship but if the balance is thrown off, it can become parasitic. Collectors are the host body, and the host can only maintain a certain number of parasites before it becomes ill. I don't think we are there yet, but speculators seem to multiply faster than collectors, like weeds versus an old growth forrest. This analogy may be offensive to some, but I don't mean it to be because I don't have a problem with ethical speculators.

Oh, and a guy that sells a GA book and upgrades is not necessarily a speculator. Collectors have long preferred high grade books, hence the demand. I think you can trace the multiples of guide value for high grade books to the Edgar Church collection. Many of those books have not changed hands since Chuck sold them. The people that bought those books were and still are old growth collectors.

This kind of "speculation" can also be seen a sort of "dark side" for the collector and the normal guy (I mean all those which are not dealers by profession): it makes you slip in the frame of mind that you have to buy and sell to earn money mostly to fund your collecting.

Regardless of the content, it seems.

What's everyone's thought on Avenging Spider-Man 9 (Carol Danvers as Captain Marvrel)? I see that the print run was pretty small for an issue like this (a little over 37,000). I asked this elsewhere, but would you pick up a second copy?

What's everyone's thought on Avenging Spider-Man 9 (Carol Danvers as Captain Marvrel)? I see that the print run was pretty small for an issue like this (a little over 37,000). I asked this elsewhere, but would you pick up a second copy?

I found two for cover collecting dust at an LCS earlier this year, so I bought both of them. I don't know where it'll settle, but I've seen them priced anywhere from $10 to $40 since then. Personally though, I think it's a great book to have, and having duplicates for decent price wouldn't be too much of a risk, I don't think.

What's everyone's thought on Avenging Spider-Man 9 (Carol Danvers as Captain Marvrel)? I see that the print run was pretty small for an issue like this (a little over 37,000). I asked this elsewhere, but would you pick up a second copy?

I found two for cover collecting dust at an LCS earlier this year, so I bought both of them. I don't know where it'll settle, but I've seen them priced anywhere from $10 to $40 since then. Personally though, I think it's a great book to have, and having duplicates for decent price wouldn't be too much of a risk, I don't think.

What about the Summer Of Spider-Man issue....?

I see that selling for about $8 right now. How much of CM is shown?

Lot of logic here. Currently the market is full of speculators who weren't in the market a few years ago. You only need to look at the growth of Goggle Groups, Facebook and Speculator web sites. This has all exploded in the last couple of years. Good or bad it will take a few years to play out. Its happened before some of us are old enough to have had a prime seat when it happened last time.

 

1st app vs cameos is a prime example of the changing mentality. I am not sure it will stay around, but at some point somebody is going to get tired of paying thru the nose for a book with just a cover appearance. The trick currently is convincing the next guy. Its pretty easy to see it when the only discussion is a print run, 1st appearance, or variant.

 

 

Very true. I am one of those speculators who got back into the mix thanks to these websites.

 

Heyyyyyy, I resemble those remarks. I got back into the hobby in Aug 2013. I thought variants were very cool and bought a lot of them. Now, I still speculate on moderns but I know enough to have Silver, Bronze and a little Copper in my collection and to not buy so many variants.

 

It's all a learning experience. Unfortunately, the "old guard" are pretty uppity when it comes to speculation.

 

Regardless of what people think about how others should spend THEIR OWN money, the hobby is just fine. In fact, some of the new collectors/speculators are the ones buying their Gold, Silver, Bronze and Copper so that they can buy that same book in a higher grade (speculation). It's still called speculation. Even "readers" aren't buying books to fold up and put it in their back pocket. Books are read very carefully so as not to cause any, or more, damage, speculating that the book will not decrease in "value". Speculation, Holmes.

 

Again you weren't here for the last go around with large scale speculation from card dealers. So please don't tell me you understand the market when you just above admitted to being a victim when you started.

 

I got nothing personal against speculation. We all do it some extent. Even your ridiculous paragraph about doesn't really bother me. Where I have issues is just the outright lying and manipulation that comes with large scale speculation. Or when speculator web site pump a book that they themselves have bought dozens of copies. You cant be unbiased when you are vested in the success of the book you are reporting on.

 

I seriously doubt you know what readers do with their books or even what they read.

I do not think all spec sites are trying to market manipulate or doing it to sell their own books. I know there are a couple that do, but several that don't.

I talked to my LCS owner earlier today, he told me that SDTU #12 had a print run of 7000.

 

I asked if he was sure of that and he said he was.

 

Except there's no where he could've gotten that information. He has no proof.

 

I normally order 2 copies of Scooby Do TU for my store, I ordered 12 of #12. I'm certainly not the only person who upped their order on it.

 

I'm also thinking it's going to be in the 10-12,000 range. At least.

 

I'll ask him where he got that figure of 7,000 from, , in a couple days, next time I stop by his shop.

 

He also said that he thought the book was worthless and he was annoyed that he had 5 people walk in, he had never seen before, asking if he had any copies.

 

He has 0 copies for sale, FTR.

 

I've known the guy for a couple years, he's a pretty straight forward guy and he does not chase after ,or push, hot books.That said, he has no motive to tell me that he was "sure" that the print run was 7000.

 

Maybe he knows somebody at DC or Diamond and got some inside intelligence...or maybe not.hell if I know.

 

In any event, even if the print run was as low as 7000, that is not inordinately rare and the book has *absolutely no* tie in to DC continuity, nor the Suicide Squad movie related scenery.

 

Some dooshbag sellers are listing it as " the 1st App. Gotham Girls"....which is an outright fabrication.Just saying, it is the sort of gimmicky hot book that speculators hear has a super low print run and morally bankrupt eBay flippers use any means they can dream of to get multiples of cover price for a book that came out 2 weeks ago.

 

Once CGC gets flooded with subs of this book,I think the price point on slabbed 9.8's will be around $25 to $50.

I read on another site that someone asked Diamond at a comic con what the print run was and they were told 20,000 and that Diamond basically tripled the normal Scooby amount to account for the Harley factor.

All rumors and speculation though.

And yes, 30-40 for a 9.8 seems a likely landing point.

Lot of logic here. Currently the market is full of speculators who weren't in the market a few years ago. You only need to look at the growth of Goggle Groups, Facebook and Speculator web sites. This has all exploded in the last couple of years. Good or bad it will take a few years to play out. Its happened before some of us are old enough to have had a prime seat when it happened last time.

 

1st app vs cameos is a prime example of the changing mentality. I am not sure it will stay around, but at some point somebody is going to get tired of paying thru the nose for a book with just a cover appearance. The trick currently is convincing the next guy. Its pretty easy to see it when the only discussion is a print run, 1st appearance, or variant.

 

 

Very true. I am one of those speculators who got back into the mix thanks to these websites.

 

Heyyyyyy, I resemble those remarks. I got back into the hobby in Aug 2013. I thought variants were very cool and bought a lot of them. Now, I still speculate on moderns but I know enough to have Silver, Bronze and a little Copper in my collection and to not buy so many variants.

 

It's all a learning experience. Unfortunately, the "old guard" are pretty uppity when it comes to speculation.

 

Regardless of what people think about how others should spend THEIR OWN money, the hobby is just fine. In fact, some of the new collectors/speculators are the ones buying their Gold, Silver, Bronze and Copper so that they can buy that same book in a higher grade (speculation). It's still called speculation. Even "readers" aren't buying books to fold up and put it in their back pocket. Books are read very carefully so as not to cause any, or more, damage, speculating that the book will not decrease in "value". Speculation, Holmes.

 

Again you weren't here for the last go around with large scale speculation from card dealers. So please don't tell me you understand the market when you just above admitted to being a victim when you started.

 

I got nothing personal against speculation. We all do it some extent. Even your ridiculous paragraph about doesn't really bother me. Where I have issues is just the outright lying and manipulation that comes with large scale speculation. Or when speculator web site pump a book that they themselves have bought dozens of copies. You cant be unbiased when you are vested in the success of the book you are reporting on.

 

I seriously doubt you know what readers do with their books or even what they read.

 

I do not think all spec sites are trying to market manipulate or doing it to sell their own books. I know there are a couple that do, but several that don't.

Why on earth would anyone spend the time to create a site on speculation books for any reason other than to sell the ones they have?