Cerebus 1 a more valuable key than Hulk 181? Really Overstreet? Poll on Page 87

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The price of Cerebus 1 has been flat in a 9.4 for more than the last 10 years. Look at your own GPA numbers - A 9.4 sold for $9k this past March, which is more than $1k LESS than however many years ago the last 9.4 sold for.

 

So actually the book has DECLINED in value. Meanwhile Hulk 181 has been exploding in the last 12 months. What's the basis for your belief that a 9.2 has INCREASED in value when the value in its top grade has DECLINED MORE THAN 10%?

Your numbers are incorrect. Conclusions based on those numbers are necessarily flawed.

Ask a comic book dealer. Slabs are a SMALL percentage of sales for comic books.

So we should use the sale of raw books as a sample?

Bueller? Bronzejonny? Bueller?

Ask a comic book dealer. Slabs are a SMALL percentage of sales for comic books.

 

So we should use the sale of raw books as a sample?

There you are!

I was worried!

Bueller? Bronzejonny? Bueller?

 

Did you think up this on your own?

The price of Cerebus 1 has been flat in a 9.4 for more than the last 10 years. Look at your own GPA numbers - A 9.4 sold for $9k this past March, which is more than $1k LESS than however many years ago the last 9.4 sold for.

 

So actually the book has DECLINED in value. Meanwhile Hulk 181 has been exploding in the last 12 months. What's the basis for your belief that a 9.2 has INCREASED in value when the value in its top grade has DECLINED MORE THAN 10%?

 

Your numbers are incorrect. Conclusions based on those numbers are necessarily flawed.

 

If they're wrong, show me the correct numbers HAL.

The price of Cerebus 1 has been flat in a 9.4 for more than the last 10 years. Look at your own GPA numbers - A 9.4 sold for $9k this past March, which is more than $1k LESS than however many years ago the last 9.4 sold for.

 

So actually the book has DECLINED in value. Meanwhile Hulk 181 has been exploding in the last 12 months. What's the basis for your belief that a 9.2 has INCREASED in value when the value in its top grade has DECLINED MORE THAN 10%?

 

Your numbers are incorrect. Conclusions based on those numbers are necessarily flawed.

 

 

If they're wrong, show me the correct numbers HAL.

I already did, Kanye.

Bueller? Bronzejonny? Bueller?

 

 

Did you think up this on your own?

Yes.

The price of Cerebus 1 has been flat in a 9.4 for more than the last 10 years. Look at your own GPA numbers - A 9.4 sold for $9k this past March, which is more than $1k LESS than however many years ago the last 9.4 sold for.

 

So actually the book has DECLINED in value. Meanwhile Hulk 181 has been exploding in the last 12 months. What's the basis for your belief that a 9.2 has INCREASED in value when the value in its top grade has DECLINED MORE THAN 10%?

 

Your numbers are incorrect. Conclusions based on those numbers are necessarily flawed.

 

 

If they're wrong, show me the correct numbers HAL.

 

I already did, Kanye.

Kanye gets a Kardasian

HAL gets an obelisk?

HAL, I'm going to sleep now. Good night.

Kanye gets a Kardash...

So, if you had only one opportunity in your life time to add only one of these books to your collection in CGC 9.2 which would it be?

 

Hulk 181

 

or

 

Cerebus 1

 

Remember, only one chance in a lifetime to pick one of these 2 books (and both happen to be CGC 9.2s with white pages).

 

Me personally? The Cerebus 1. But that has nothing to do with this discussion.

 

I would take a 35 cent Scooby Doo #1 over either of them, and I demand to see it crack the OSPG Top Ten immediately.

 

So would I

 

So, you're ok with never having Hulk 181 in your collection? A variant is more significant to you?

 

I can get a Hulk 181 every day of the week. I'd take the Scooby even in vastly lower grade.

 

Lets take an average BMW... and an average Toyota. Which one is more valuable? The BMW.

 

Now, let's say someone found 10.000 more of each (or the companies decided to make 10.000 more of each..same thing) then .... which oen is now the more valuable?

 

Obviously still the BMW... it is just a better and more valuable car..

 

right?

 

.....

 

Think like a businessman....which one...?

 

You're now comparing cars to comic books....?

 

What if the moon was made of gold? Would you arrange a trip there to mine some?

 

Forget my comparison then.

 

Just answer this:

 

Let's say someone found 10.000 H181s and 10.000 Cerebus 1s...(all in 9.4 grade)

 

As a dealer.... which load would you buy?

 

The 10.000 IH181s.. or the 10.000 Cerebus 1s?

 

Think like a businessman....which one...?

But I can't think like a businessman, because you've completely changed the dynamic. There aren't 10,000 Cerebus 1s. If there were, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation.

Loads,phallic seas,laws of contraception,eating hearts...this thread has it all,including flying donuts,HAL,Kanye.....but no cal...cal.....cal....

Loads,phallic seas,laws of contraception,eating hearts...this thread has it all,including flying donuts,HAL,Kanye.....but no cal...cal.....cal....

No Cal, butt a Kardashian.

So just so we have something to show for the 10,000+ word essays Jaydog and RMA have put into this healthy debate can we all agree on the following?:

1.)In 9.4 Cerebus #1 is undoubtably more valuable than Hulk 181.

2.)In 9.2, the 181 and Cerebus are too close to call. The lack of recent Cerebus 1 sales in grade (available through public data points) and a few all time high 181's in 9.2 make for a compelling argument, but if both books were listed in 10 day auctions on the same venue the line in Vegas would be close to even as to which would bring the higher hammer price. Just how close these books are in price is further evidenced by OPG changing their rankings year over year.

3.)In 9.0 and below, the 181 is decisively pricier than Cerebus #1.

4.)DC 100 Page Super Spectacular #5 has no business making the BA top 10 list.

5.)Star Wars #1 $.35 variant is hands down the most valuable book of the genre.

So just so we have something to show for the 10,000+ word essays Jaydog and RMA have put into this healthy debate can we all agree on the following?:

 

1.)In 9.4 Cerebus #1 is undoubtably more valuable than Hulk 181 (in 9.4)(Continuously proven by: Any national dealer on this board, if given a chance, would buy a Cerebus #1 CGC 9.4 over a Hulk #181 CGC 9.4 - if offered either one or the other - for $500.)

 

2.)In 9.2, the 181 and Cerebus are too close to call. The lack of recent Cerebus 1 sales in grade (available through public data points) and a few all time high 181's in 9.2 make for a compelling argument, but if both books were listed in 10 day auctions on the same venue the line in Vegas would be close to even as to which would bring the higher hammer price. Just how close these books are in price is further evidenced by OPG changing their rankings year over year. The 'Vegas' line would favor Cerebus for at least two reasons and one, this thread shows us: Besides dealers and those seeking the book themselves, most fan boys have no clue of the draw of a HG copy of that book or that it even makes this much noise in the market. And two, a Hulk 181 in 9.2: Big Whooptity Doo. You can find that any day of the week.

 

3.)In 9.0 and below, the 181 is decisively pricier than Cerebus #1. you mean in 8.5

 

4.)DC 100 Page Super Spectacular #5 has no business making the BA top 10 list. A 9.4 just sold in June for $1856 - A Bronze Age 9.4 for $1856 belongs on this list.

 

5.)Star Wars #1 $.35 variant is hands down the most valuable book of the genre. I think a straight up 9.6 of this would beat a 9.6 Cerebus, but it would be a worthy battle, and yet... the 35 cent Star Wars is accepted as legitimate and the Cerebus has to fight for respect. Weird.

And keep in mind... not all sales are listed on GPA, even from the auction houses. This would be higher than anything on GPA for the book in 8.5, listed in July and already sold:

It is this kind of nerd fight and not the more obvious Thor vs. Hulk variety that defines hardcore comic fandom.

So just so we have something to show for the 10,000+ word essays Jaydog and RMA have put into this healthy debate can we all agree on the following?:

 

1.)In 9.4 Cerebus #1 is undoubtably more valuable than Hulk 181 (in 9.4)(Continuously proven by: Any national dealer on this board, if given a chance, would buy a Cerebus #1 CGC 9.4 over a Hulk #181 CGC 9.4 - if offered either one or the other - for $500.)

 

2.)In 9.2, the 181 and Cerebus are too close to call. The lack of recent Cerebus 1 sales in grade (available through public data points) and a few all time high 181's in 9.2 make for a compelling argument, but if both books were listed in 10 day auctions on the same venue the line in Vegas would be close to even as to which would bring the higher hammer price. Just how close these books are in price is further evidenced by OPG changing their rankings year over year. The 'Vegas' line would favor Cerebus for at least two reasons and one, this thread shows us: Besides dealers and those seeking the book themselves, most fan boys have no clue of the draw of a HG copy of that book or that it even makes this much noise in the market. And two, a Hulk 181 in 9.2: Big Whooptity Doo. You can find that any day of the week.

 

3.)In 9.0 and below, the 181 is decisively pricier than Cerebus #1. you mean in 8.5

 

4.)DC 100 Page Super Spectacular #5 has no business making the BA top 10 list. A 9.4 just sold in June for $1856 - A Bronze Age 9.4 for $1856 belongs on this list.

 

5.)Star Wars #1 $.35 variant is hands down the most valuable book of the genre. I think a straight up 9.6 of this would beat a 9.6 Cerebus, but it would be a worthy battle, and yet... the 35 cent Star Wars is accepted as legitimate and the Cerebus has to fight for respect. Weird.

 

And keep in mind... not all sales are listed on GPA, even from the auction houses. This would be higher than anything on GPA for the book in 8.5, listed in July and already sold:

 

Chuck, dude, seriously. You're obviously a HUGE fan of Cerebus but try to at least have some air of objectivity:

THIS is the most recent, publicly available closed sale of a Cerebus 1, 8.5:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CEREBUS-1-CGC-8-5-2000-PRINT-RUN-SUPER-RARE-IN-THIS-CONDITION-HTF-/251567379955?pt=US_Comic_Books&hash=item3a929595f3

THIS is the most recent, publicly available closed sale of a Hulk 181, 8.5:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-INCREDIBLE-HULK-181-1st-app-Wolverine-CGC-8-5-VF-Marvel-Comics-1974-/360905693614?pt=US_Comic_Books&hash=item5407a7d9ae

Even if that Comiclink sale goes through, Hulk 181 still blows it out of the water at that grade.

THIS is the most recent, publicly available sale for a Hulk 181, 9.0:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Incredible-Hulk-181-CGC-9-0-OW-1st-Appearance-of-Wolverine-of-the-X-Men-/231302168936?pt=US_Comic_Books&hash=item35daaf0168

When was the last time a Cerebus 1, 9.0 blue went for that?

Oh, right.

And you're STILL trying to have your cake and eat it too, dismissing the new high sale of hulk 181 9.2 because you can find one "any day of the week", and then merely SPECULATING on what a scarcer 9.2 Cerebus 1 would go for now (in its favor of course), BECAUSE NO 9.2 CEREBUS 1 HAS EVER SOLD ANYWHERE CLOSE TO THE AMOUNT OF THAT HULK 181 9.2:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/INCREDIBLE-HULK-181-WHITE-PAGES-CGC-GRADED-9-2-NOVEMBER-1974-/400755267796?pt=US_Comic_Books&hash=item5d4ee018d4

Oh, and just for the hell of it...why don't you tell me how many Hulk 181 9.2's are available right now on ebay? Comic link.....? comic connect....? mycomicshop.....? On these boards.....? What's that you say? NONE? Really Chuck? For a "common" book in any grade I can find any day of the week, you mean to tell me that today, on a Saturday there actually ISN'T one available in a 9.2?

You think THAT might have something to do with why the buyer decided to pull the trigger at that price? Supply and demand, right? Just like you state for the cerebus 1.

And what about this rampant speculation that you are employing, based on absolutely no data points whatsoever, that a 9.2 cerebus 1 could sniff 3K right now? Surely with inflation it would get that at an auction now right?

The fact that a 9.4 cerebus 1 has DECREASED in value about 15% in the last 10 years (as another poster has noted) is very strong circumstantial evidence to suggest "No". Where an 8.5 is closing at right now suggests "No". The fact that a 9.0 has never even hit $2,000 suggests "No". Please do tell me, what publicly available sales data are you using that tells you otherwise? Or is it just "wishful thinking"? Why let facts and actual sales figures get in the way of the myth you want to perpetuate about this book, right? Do you have some copies you want to sell soon or something? You keep talking about which book a dealer would buy if they had $500 to spend. What does that have to do with anything? This thread was started because the OP thought it was ridiculous for cerebus to be called "more valuable" by Overstreet on his BA list. And it IS ridiculous. Patently ridiculous.

I have never disputed that a cerebus 1 9.4 has sold for more than a hulk 181 9.4. That is the only thing you have said that has been accurate and supported by verifiable sales data.

And my response to that has always been that a small print run book with literally only a handful of copies available in its respective top grade (cerebus 1)outselling another far more mainstream book, with 80X more copies available in that one grade (hulk 181, and not even its top grade, or second top grade, or third top grade) is not a "real world" way to determine that said book is "more valuable" than the other. It just isn't. Overstreet needs to revise his criteria, because that is simply laughable. Especially when the other book, as the most recent publicly available sales indicate, OUT PERFORMS IT IN EVERY SINGLE OTHER GRADE. Whether you wish to acknowledge it or not, it is what it is.

-J.

So just so we have something to show for the 10,000+ word essays Jaydog and RMA have put into this healthy debate can we all agree on the following?:

 

1.)In 9.4 Cerebus #1 is undoubtably more valuable than Hulk 181 (in 9.4)(Continuously proven by: Any national dealer on this board, if given a chance, would buy a Cerebus #1 CGC 9.4 over a Hulk #181 CGC 9.4 - if offered either one or the other - for $500.)

 

2.)In 9.2, the 181 and Cerebus are too close to call. The lack of recent Cerebus 1 sales in grade (available through public data points) and a few all time high 181's in 9.2 make for a compelling argument, but if both books were listed in 10 day auctions on the same venue the line in Vegas would be close to even as to which would bring the higher hammer price. Just how close these books are in price is further evidenced by OPG changing their rankings year over year. The 'Vegas' line would favor Cerebus for at least two reasons and one, this thread shows us: Besides dealers and those seeking the book themselves, most fan boys have no clue of the draw of a HG copy of that book or that it even makes this much noise in the market. And two, a Hulk 181 in 9.2: Big Whooptity Doo. You can find that any day of the week.

 

3.)In 9.0 and below, the 181 is decisively pricier than Cerebus #1. you mean in 8.5

 

4.)DC 100 Page Super Spectacular #5 has no business making the BA top 10 list. A 9.4 just sold in June for $1856 - A Bronze Age 9.4 for $1856 belongs on this list.

 

5.)Star Wars #1 $.35 variant is hands down the most valuable book of the genre. I think a straight up 9.6 of this would beat a 9.6 Cerebus, but it would be a worthy battle, and yet... the 35 cent Star Wars is accepted as legitimate and the Cerebus has to fight for respect. Weird.

 

And keep in mind... not all sales are listed on GPA, even from the auction houses. This would be higher than anything on GPA for the book in 8.5, listed in July and already sold:

 

1.)You're right

2.)If another Hulk 181 9.2 goes for over $3k, it would be a slight favorite. Let me ask you this. If every house in your neighborhood has sold for $250k until your neighbor, in an identical home, gets $300k. Do you list your house for $250k or $300k?

3.)It's close as well, but with the recent Cerebus #1 8.5's sales I believe the weak #'s would pull the third highest graded 9.0's down with them. 181 would be favored, head to head, in a 10 day auction.

4.)You do a great job of cherry-picking highest graded 9.4's. In 9.2, the latest GPA pedigree sale (Savannah), was almost 50% lower than the prior recorded sale. (I know GPA isn't the only place OPG gets it's data)

5.)Because it's one of the rarest, most collectible Star Wars pieces on the planet in high grade. It's the champ. A 9.2 would sell for double the Cerebus #1 in the same grade.