PROBATION DISCUSSIONS

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Does anyone have contact information for The Silver Age ?

He sold me a book with undisclosed restoration. Ironman #1, I had it slabbed and was shocked to find it was trimmed.

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=185361&Number=3835526#Post3835526

I have tried to PM him and also tried to contact him through ebay. He has not posted since November. I am thinking he may have been unaware of the trim. I would like to give him a chance to make things right. But he seems to have disappeared. Any help would be appreciated.

 

 

This person has a track record it seems.

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=5888981&fpart=1

 

He recently sent me a PM stating

 

I just got this message. Sorry I haven't been on the boards here for several years now. Kinda lost interest in selling for awhile ya know? I am REALLY sorry about the book. I bought it from a VERY reliable and reputable well known seller to the community a year or so before I sold it. I was assured it was unrestored.

 

looks like the original sale was almost 3 1/2 years ago. I'm really really sorry about that. there is nothing worse than getting a re-stored book! I think we've all gone through it unfortunately.

 

I don't sell much anymore, at least not at the moment. not sure what I can do 3 yrs later, but I would like to make it up to you in some way. I assure you, my intentions are not to deceive or take advantage of anyone. I have an extensive collection that I do plan on selling eventually, and my reputation is everything to me.

 

I honestly don't know what to do to make this up to you. do you still own the book perhaps?

 

Trey

 

 

When I countered that I paid him $400. for the book and it sold at auction for $73, and I believed he should pay the difference, he replied

 

 

Wow Bill,

 

A bit hostile. I understand your frustration man, I really do. And I in no way shape or form was trying to deceive you. I didn't know the book was trimmed, otherwise I wouldn't have bought it.

 

I came back on here to look for info on another seller and saw I had a message. When I read it, I felt really terrible. But your response is nothing but hostile threats and an attempt at blackmail for a transaction that took place 2 yrs before you finally contacted me.

 

Ask yourself Bill, if I was trying to avoid you or purposely deceive you, why would I respond to a message that's over a year and half old?

 

Your response is bad form. And my initial feeling of sorrow and responsibility has been edged out by surprise at your threatening response.

 

 

I am at a loss here. What is reasonable compensation for an undisclosed trimmed book? I want to add him to the probation list, but I want to have a reasonable way for him to get off, if he chooses to do the right thing.

I think that based on everything I've read (the FF #1, the other "hijacked" accounts, Nicks missing books, and this one, the PL should be skipped and this guy should go right to the HOS. Anyone disagree?

I don't disagree with a HOS nomination but more for the other thread than for this 3 year old issue...

I think there's a time limit on enforceable seller liability when it comes to undetected restoration.....a great dealer might always reimburse but I think only certain collectors are going to chase beyond a reasonable time frame.

I have a couple still expensive raw books that I bought a couple years ago, if they came back purple I feel it's my problem not the guy who sold it to me two years ago. If I were to sell one of them raw; I want the book back if it comes back purple...don't dump it & come looking for losses.

I'm curious what kind of PM gets a "wow Bill"

Agree with bababooey. There is a reasonable expectation on a book going to CGC. I'd say in general one year. As a seller, I also should have a reasonable expectation of believing a sale is closed. I always guarantee my raws as being unrestored, but if a buyer came to me three years later I would of course work with them to fix the issue, but I am less likely to refund them in full. I think the HOS worthiness is less to do with the time frame and more to do with the thread.

I don't disagree that there is s limit to holding a seller responsible. I was reading from the phone and thought the buyer had messaged him earlier and just had not rec'd a response because the one message from the seller questioned why would he respond to a message that was a year and a half old. It was my error on that one, but still think the guy belongs on the HOS.

Yeah, after reading that thread, it sounds like he is HoS material. But that's what several people in the thread said more than a year ago ....

Does anyone have contact information for The Silver Age ?

He sold me a book with undisclosed restoration. Ironman #1, I had it slabbed and was shocked to find it was trimmed.

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=185361&Number=3835526#Post3835526

I have tried to PM him and also tried to contact him through ebay. He has not posted since November. I am thinking he may have been unaware of the trim. I would like to give him a chance to make things right. But he seems to have disappeared. Any help would be appreciated.

 

 

This person has a track record it seems.

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=5888981&fpart=1

 

He recently sent me a PM stating

 

I just got this message. Sorry I haven't been on the boards here for several years now. Kinda lost interest in selling for awhile ya know? I am REALLY sorry about the book. I bought it from a VERY reliable and reputable well known seller to the community a year or so before I sold it. I was assured it was unrestored.

 

looks like the original sale was almost 3 1/2 years ago. I'm really really sorry about that. there is nothing worse than getting a re-stored book! I think we've all gone through it unfortunately.

 

I don't sell much anymore, at least not at the moment. not sure what I can do 3 yrs later, but I would like to make it up to you in some way. I assure you, my intentions are not to deceive or take advantage of anyone. I have an extensive collection that I do plan on selling eventually, and my reputation is everything to me.

 

I honestly don't know what to do to make this up to you. do you still own the book perhaps?

 

Trey

 

 

When I countered that I paid him $400. for the book and it sold at auction for $73, and I believed he should pay the difference, he replied

 

 

Wow Bill,

 

A bit hostile. I understand your frustration man, I really do. And I in no way shape or form was trying to deceive you. I didn't know the book was trimmed, otherwise I wouldn't have bought it.

 

I came back on here to look for info on another seller and saw I had a message. When I read it, I felt really terrible. But your response is nothing but hostile threats and an attempt at blackmail for a transaction that took place 2 yrs before you finally contacted me.

 

Ask yourself Bill, if I was trying to avoid you or purposely deceive you, why would I respond to a message that's over a year and half old?

 

Your response is bad form. And my initial feeling of sorrow and responsibility has been edged out by surprise at your threatening response.

 

 

I am at a loss here. What is reasonable compensation for an undisclosed trimmed book? I want to add him to the probation list, but I want to have a reasonable way for him to get off, if he chooses to do the right thing.

You've posted his exact PMs. Could you please post your exact PMs also.

Full PM conversation.

Hi,

I bought an Ironman #1 from you in this sales thread

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=185361&Number=3835526#Post3835526

 

I just got it back from CGC as an 8.0 Restored-bottom edge trimmed. I believe you should have disclosed the restoration. To say the least this is very disappointing.

Bill

I just got this message. Sorry I haven't been on the boards here for several years now. Kinda lost interest in selling for awhile ya know? I am REALLY sorry about the book. I bought it from a VERY reliable and reputable well known seller to the community a year or so before I sold it. I was assured it was unrestored.

 

looks like the original sale was almost 3 1/2 years ago. I'm really really sorry about that. there is nothing worse than getting a re-stored book! I think we've all gone through it unfortunately.

 

I don't sell much anymore, at least not at the moment. not sure what I can do 3 yrs later, but I would like to make it up to you in some way. I assure you, my intentions are not to deceive or take advantage of anyone. I have an extensive collection that I do plan on selling eventually, and my reputation is everything to me.

 

I honestly don't know what to do to make this up to you. do you still own the book perhaps?

 

Trey

Hi Trey,

I purchased the book for $400. I attempted to contact you on ebay as well as here. You were actively selling on ebay and had an Avengers #1 listed for sale. I had no choice but to conclude you were avoiding the problem. I nominated you to the probation list, and the community approved it. The only reason you are not on the list is because you were no longer active, but make no mistake if you are going to sell books I will complete the nomination process. I hope you will do the right thing and fix this.

I believe your avenue to fix this is clear. I paid $400 for the book and sold it at auction for $73.00. You may look it up on ebay in my sold listings. The buyer is also a boardie Calamerica. The difference is owed me for me to revoke your probation list nomination. Balance $400-$73.00, Due is $327.00.

The choice is yours, but I believe to make matters right I am due the balance of my loss for $327.00. I have absorbed all shipping and slabbing costs, so I still stand at a loss, so understand that this is not in any way a win for anyone, it just seems the fair thing to do.

 

Thank You

Bill

Wow Bill,

 

A bit hostile. I understand your frustration man, I really do. And I in no way shape or form was trying to deceive you. I didn't know the book was trimmed, otherwise I wouldn't have bought it.

 

I came back on here to look for info on another seller and saw I had a message. When I read it, I felt really terrible. But your response is nothing but hostile threats and an attempt at blackmail for a transaction that took place 2 yrs before you finally contacted me.

 

Ask yourself Bill, if I was trying to avoid you or purposely deceive you, why would I respond to a message that's over a year and half old?

 

Your response is bad form. And my initial feeling of sorrow and responsibility has been edged out by surprise at your threatening response.

I would like to make it up to you in some way.

 

Trey

 

I made a proposal how this can be accomplished.

 

 

your response is nothing but hostile threats and an attempt at blackmail

 

Please reread what I wrote. The olive branch was firmly extended. Your accusatory response is puzzling to me. I am offended

 

my reputation is everything to me.

 

 

 

Trey

Your reputation may need some repair, from what is being said here.

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=5888981&fpart=1

First I've ever heard of a stolen FF#1

But yes, my eBay and Paypal acct was hacked twice many years ago.

Strangely, the same Trey McDaniel 'sold' me a couple of slabs on eBay...a Strange Tales and a Spidey totalling around $400...and I never received them and never got refunded.

 

Some cock and bull story regarding his account getting hacked...although they were exactly the sort of things he dealt with both before and after the 'hacking'.

 

The original poster was not the only one with concerns about your transactions.

Best of luck, but as another poster noted.

 

Well, you should check out the probation thread, definitely, because you are taking on some water there as well.

 

Full PM conversation.

 

Hi,

I bought an Ironman #1 from you in this sales thread

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=185361&Number=3835526#Post3835526

 

I just got it back from CGC as an 8.0 Restored-bottom edge trimmed. I believe you should have disclosed the restoration. To say the least this is very disappointing.

Bill

 

Just curious, and trying to get to the bottom of this. The sales transaction was entered into on 3/3/10.

What amount of time passed between the IM1 purchase here, the return of the graded book, and your email above?

Sounds like you attempted to contact him through eBay channels as well.

Full PM conversation.

 

Hi,

I bought an Ironman #1 from you in this sales thread

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=185361&Number=3835526#Post3835526

 

I just got it back from CGC as an 8.0 Restored-bottom edge trimmed. I believe you should have disclosed the restoration. To say the least this is very disappointing.

Bill

 

I just got this message. Sorry I haven't been on the boards here for several years now. Kinda lost interest in selling for awhile ya know? I am REALLY sorry about the book. I bought it from a VERY reliable and reputable well known seller to the community a year or so before I sold it. I was assured it was unrestored.

 

looks like the original sale was almost 3 1/2 years ago. I'm really really sorry about that. there is nothing worse than getting a re-stored book! I think we've all gone through it unfortunately.

 

I don't sell much anymore, at least not at the moment. not sure what I can do 3 yrs later, but I would like to make it up to you in some way. I assure you, my intentions are not to deceive or take advantage of anyone. I have an extensive collection that I do plan on selling eventually, and my reputation is everything to me.

 

I honestly don't know what to do to make this up to you. do you still own the book perhaps?

 

Trey

 

Hi Trey,

I purchased the book for $400. I attempted to contact you on ebay as well as here. You were actively selling on ebay and had an Avengers #1 listed for sale. I had no choice but to conclude you were avoiding the problem. I nominated you to the probation list, and the community approved it. The only reason you are not on the list is because you were no longer active, but make no mistake if you are going to sell books I will complete the nomination process. I hope you will do the right thing and fix this.

I believe your avenue to fix this is clear. I paid $400 for the book and sold it at auction for $73.00. You may look it up on ebay in my sold listings. The buyer is also a boardie Calamerica. The difference is owed me for me to revoke your probation list nomination. Balance $400-$73.00, Due is $327.00.

The choice is yours, but I believe to make matters right I am due the balance of my loss for $327.00. I have absorbed all shipping and slabbing costs, so I still stand at a loss, so understand that this is not in any way a win for anyone, it just seems the fair thing to do.

 

Thank You

Bill

 

Wow Bill,

 

A bit hostile. I understand your frustration man, I really do. And I in no way shape or form was trying to deceive you. I didn't know the book was trimmed, otherwise I wouldn't have bought it.

 

I came back on here to look for info on another seller and saw I had a message. When I read it, I felt really terrible. But your response is nothing but hostile threats and an attempt at blackmail for a transaction that took place 2 yrs before you finally contacted me.

 

Ask yourself Bill, if I was trying to avoid you or purposely deceive you, why would I respond to a message that's over a year and half old?

 

Your response is bad form. And my initial feeling of sorrow and responsibility has been edged out by surprise at your threatening response.

 

I would like to make it up to you in some way.

 

Trey

 

I made a proposal how this can be accomplished.

 

 

your response is nothing but hostile threats and an attempt at blackmail

 

Please reread what I wrote. The olive branch was firmly extended. Your accusatory response is puzzling to me. I am offended

 

 

my reputation is everything to me.

 

 

 

Trey

Your reputation may need some repair, from what is being said here.

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=5888981&fpart=1

 

First I've ever heard of a stolen FF#1

But yes, my eBay and Paypal acct was hacked twice many years ago.

 

Strangely, the same Trey McDaniel 'sold' me a couple of slabs on eBay...a Strange Tales and a Spidey totalling around $400...and I never received them and never got refunded.

 

Some cock and bull story regarding his account getting hacked...although they were exactly the sort of things he dealt with both before and after the 'hacking'.

 

The original poster was not the only one with concerns about your transactions.

Best of luck, but as another poster noted.

 

Well, you should check out the probation thread, definitely, because you are taking on some water there as well.

 

Thank you. I was wondering why Trey repeatedly commented that your pm was hostile and that you attempted to blackmail him.

I could see Trey being unaware of the problem if he wasn't hanging out here but I find it concerning that you attmepted to contact him through ebay without reply. Has he bought or sold on ebay since you sent him a message there?

 

Just curious, and trying to get to the bottom of this. The sales transaction was entered into on 3/3/10.

 

What amount of time passed between the IM1 purchase here, the return of the graded book, and your email above?

 

Sounds like you attempted to contact him through eBay channels as well.

I agree the claim may not be timely. My PM to him was 1/17/12

I am sorry I could not find my ebay communication, but my recollection was it was a few days prior to here since at that time he had not posted in 2 months.

There was a delay because I wanted to have a larger submission to CGC, and use my coupon. I also had my submission pressed prior to submission. I attempted to contact him as soon as I got the book back from CGC.

I was truly surprised to hear from him after so long - his first response was yesterday.

Has he bought or sold on ebay since you sent him a message there?

It looks like he is currently a used car salesman

http://www.ebay.com/sch/the_silver-age/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p3686

 

Just curious, and trying to get to the bottom of this. The sales transaction was entered into on 3/3/10.

 

What amount of time passed between the IM1 purchase here, the return of the graded book, and your email above?

 

Sounds like you attempted to contact him through eBay channels as well.

 

I agree the claim may not be timely. My PM to him was 1/17/12

I am sorry I could not find my ebay communication, but my recollection was it was a few days prior to here since at that time he had not posted in 2 months.

There was a delay because I wanted to have a larger submission to CGC, and use my coupon. I also had my submission pressed prior to submission. I attempted to contact him as soon as I got the book back from CGC.

I was truly surprised to hear from him after so long - his first response was yesterday.

 

The PL rules don't address this type of situation, only the 30 day transaction time frame.

But, given Mr.Zipper's experience with him (and others), 5b below would seem to apply (Being a multiple offender). Trey's sudden disappearance in the CG thread didn't bolster his credibility either.

POV may want to weigh in here, but it's my opinion that, at this point, anyone can nominate him for the HOS using a poll. And if it's to be done, it should probably be soon while the discussions are still fresh in everyone's mind.

5) Probation List versus Hall Of Shame

a) The Probation List is for transactions that have not been fulfilled as promised.

b) The Hall Of Shame is for serious transgressions. For example, selling a book/books and sending nothing of value in the package. Interfering with someone's business. Being a multiple offender.

c) The Hall Of Shame candidate is subject to all of the above rules.

d) Inclusion in the Hall Of Shame must be decided by a poll.

e) Removal from the Hall Of Shame must be decided by a poll.

Has he bought or sold on ebay since you sent him a message there?

 

It looks like he is currently a used car salesman

http://www.ebay.com/sch/the_silver-age/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p3686

Thanks. He's been active on ebay so he should have received your email through them and known about this problem.

I'm not taking sides here or anything but let's say someone on the boards sells another board member a book as a raw 9.0 for $500.

4 years later, the buyer sends the book to CGC and is given the grade of 9.6 and the buyer sells the slabbed book for $2000.

Does the original buyer owe the original seller $1500 to make things right?

FT, Mr Zipper and NP_Gresham all got burned by this guy on big books, 2 got the hacked excuse, the third got the ugh I didn't check my messages in a few years, while I sold stuff on eBay. Seems like 5B to me. One of those three should definitely HOS nominate him.

I'm not taking sides here or anything but let's say someone on the boards sells another board member a book as a raw 9.0 for $500.

4 years later, the buyer sends the book to CGC and is given the grade of 9.6 and the buyer sells the slabbed book for $2000.

Does the original buyer owe the original seller $1500 to make things right?

 

If you are comparing this to NP_Gresham's case its apples and oranges IMO. A trimmed book is not a grade issue, its an entirely different book than advertised.

crassus I agree, however I made the point earlier, he shouldn't ask for the difference between what he paid and what he got at auction, he should get the difference between what he paid ($400) and what a trimmed book in the grade advertised was at the time of the sale (i.e. what it would have sold for if the trimming had been disclosed)

crassus I agree, however I made the point earlier, he shouldn't ask for the difference between what he paid and what he got at auction, he should get the difference between what he paid ($400) and what a trimmed book in the grade advertised was at the time of the sale (i.e. what it would have sold for if the trimming had been disclosed)

Agreed. The auction move was his risk.

If I sell you a book and two years later, you come after me for a refund.... Well, you are just out of luck. Two years is far too long. Submit the book almost immediately and then I will refund. But not two years later.

Sorry. I don't care what the story or reasons are. Two years is just too long. Part of your obligation in purchasing a book, is to check it out after you get it. If you do not know how to check it out for yourself, pay someone (CGC perhaps) to check it for you.

But not years later. CGC takes a long time, but not THAT long.

Haivng said all of that. This Trey guy is not somone I would ever knowingly do business with. Either selling or buying. Appears to be a "player" with knowledge of how the games work and how to contort them, and use them, to his advantage.

Stay away Trey!

I voted "yes". My first time ever voting for this type of thing.

FT, Mr Zipper and NP_Gresham all got burned by this guy on big books, 2 got the hacked excuse, the third got the ugh I didn't check my messages in a few years, while I sold stuff on eBay. Seems like 5B to me. One of those three should definitely HOS nominate him.

There's definately a pattern and his sudden appearance and just as sudden disappearance tell me all I need to know.